http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe?format=rss Tribe.net. Local Connections http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#b545dc22-e945-4082-843d-0af21d98a188 Good call. I found a few Dickinson ballads that I'm going to try to mimic. Thanks. Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:27:04 GMT http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#b545dc22-e945-4082-843d-0af21d98a188 Julian 2009-06-30T13:27:04Z http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#595d7661-472e-4efe-bd03-397a6d25792a not sure about the textbook version...though there might be something. "Now is the winter of our discontent" - that is a good example. I suspect the discrepancy is that between spoken English in his time and presently... or perhaps the "mood" of the thing... in our language today, "now" tends to be used aggressively, as a kind of command or immediacy.. I suspect in today's English the phrase, in terms of meaning could be more clearly written... "and then came the suffering..." where "Now" is not so striking or hard or quick...but a subtle movement forward...the way we might use a pause or hesitation, rather than a direction or command... Shakespeare is probably the single most complex poet on the planet...ever. Plus, again, even though it is English, it is a very different English than modern English. It is only a few hundred years after Chaucer...and his English...which was closer to modern German, than to modern English. So, if you want to write in a formal style and experiment with meter and such, I would focus on modern work, in which the English used is that with which you are already familiar. Then, there should be less confusion. Maybe work with Dickinson, Emerson and Whitman. Their English is American English, reasonably modern and yet more formal in structure than most of the poems written today. Sat, 27 Jun 2009 03:09:05 GMT http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#595d7661-472e-4efe-bd03-397a6d25792a Jon 2009-06-27T03:09:05Z http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#064853ce-0094-40c9-a47c-5249189b0641 For instance, when I read Shakespeare's line "Now is the winter of our discontent" out loud, I just don't get a clear sense that the line is written in iambic pentameter. For me, it would be natural to stress "now" instead of "is" and to read both "of" and "our" as unstressed. So, I'm wondering if there is a textbook way to tell which syllables are stressed/unstressed, such that a poet could be judged to have failed at writing in a particular meter. Admittedly, I just might be over thinking this. Fri, 26 Jun 2009 22:13:44 GMT http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#064853ce-0094-40c9-a47c-5249189b0641 Julian 2009-06-26T22:13:44Z http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#94c42c35-651b-4d47-a205-b2e06da49046 could you give some specific examples? one idea might simply be to read the word out loud, and also read the full line of poetry out loud. That might give you a natural sense of the rhythm and "music" in the piece... when you read Shakespeare out loud, the iambic pentameter really, you know..sings. The beat is just perfect. Even if not "conscious" your own ear should be a good guide to what fits and what does not. Fri, 26 Jun 2009 00:28:56 GMT http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#94c42c35-651b-4d47-a205-b2e06da49046 Jon 2009-06-26T00:28:56Z http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#dda95f36-e765-4b7f-a11f-93e99560023d Hi all, I'm experimenting with writing formal verse (accentual-syllabic) and I am having some trouble consistently discerning stressed from unstressed syllables. There are some cases where it seems that a given word could go either way. If anyone has any pointers or resources on this to share, I'd appreciate it. Thu, 25 Jun 2009 18:01:50 GMT http://lisapoetry.tribe.net/thread/f0faed5f-d862-473b-89ee-041c656afbbe#dda95f36-e765-4b7f-a11f-93e99560023d Julian 2009-06-25T18:01:50Z